MPS vote on an outright BAN of hunting with dogs

[wocK_]

fox hunting should be banned.

Foxes should be shot if they are a pest, its the most humane way to do it . Killing foxes and trashing half the countryside while hunting is not fair on the community.

They cause damage to farmers crops due to them just running across them after the fox.

This is an example of there leetist approach to the sport, only the upper classes participate as they can afford all the gear like horses and dogs.

[The Prodigy]

''and who fucking cares about some prick off another board?''

You should because EVERYTHING that you have come out with he has TOTALLY contradicted and to back it up he has provided independent evidence from doctors and scientists that have been studying this subject for YEARS.



quote:
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Originally posted by Bash
Whether you like it or not it's a natural instinct for a dog to hunt in a pack, chase the quarry until exhaustion and rip it to bits. It's a natural instinct for all dogs. Not nice I know but hey that's the way it works, same as a pride of lions.
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So you keep saying. And I say perhaps so, but there are no more packs of wild dogs left in the UK if there ever were any (actually the wolf was the fox's main predator). Anyway, stretching such a ridiculous argument still furhter, pack dogs would probably not bother with something like a fox. They'd probably go after sheep and cattle before something as small and wily as a fox.


quote:
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Originally posted by Rich_L How about this, Anti-hunt people pay extra taxes to subsidise these 'big fences' that should be built.
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How about this: we already pay huge subsidies to farmers.


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Originally posted by Rich_L The farmer is happy with the current control methods, and pays nothing for the hunt's services.
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Not all farmers will even have hunts on their land. And what about the point I made, that you blissfully ignore, that there's evidence to suggest the dogs cause disease and upset to the livestock than they prevent?


quote:
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Originally posted by Rich_L Therefore it would only seem fair that those who are upset yet not directly affected by the acts of the hunts should pay to make them happier, by subisidising the farmers fences, so he doesnt need the hunts any more!
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a) Not all farmers need or even want hunts anyway.
b) Hunts are almost completely ineffective at controlling the fox population as I've already shown!


quote:
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Originally posted by Rich_L You are talking about 7ft fences around the farmers land here, so it could be quite a bit...
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Wow, foxes can pole vault can they? Or did you just pick that 7ft figure out of the air? If you're going to make wild claims like that, back them up.


quote:
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Originally posted by Devi8r Didn't someone say that the fox had figured out how to open a door to the chicken coop.
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Yes, so now we've had it. They'll be in and out like it's a takeaway! Simple solutions: a better/heavier mechanism or a lock.


quote:
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Originally posted by Devi8r At the end of the day the only people that have contact with foxes are the ones that don't like them. Maybe we should round them all up and and let them loose in the cities, they seem to be the ones that love them.
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They're already in the cities. They help control the rat and insect population.


quote:
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Originally posted by Bash My three spingers and one GSP all hunt together when ever I take them for a walk. Any dog whether alone or not is hunting if you notice it or not when you take it for a walk around your local park.
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Solution: feed your dog.


quote:
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Originally posted by Bash I don't bother you, so why bother me and try and ban it? That is why your debating here isn't it?
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Because you're killing animals for your own pleasure.


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Originally posted by PlacidCasual One good reason why fences aren't put up to stop foxes is, whilst theoretically possible it would cost a fortune. In doing so you would put up tens of thousands of miles of additional fencing. The cost to the farmer and hence food industry would be astronomic. We would cease animal farming altogether in this country and import all our meat. If you think British standards of farming are disgraceful towards animals dont even imagine what countries without our sophisticated checks and balances would do. Also you would be putting the control of the most fundemental strategic resource in someone elses hands.
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Tens of thousands of miles? What sort of farm do you run? What sort of farm are you talking about? Like I said, Australian farmers do just fine with much larger areas of land than our farmers. Anyway, you talk as if foxes are running amok and decimating the livestock. It's simply not true and OMG I'm going to back it up with evidence from a 5 year study:

A five year study undertaken for Department of Agriculture & Fisheries for Scotland (DAFS) revealed that whilst up to 24% of lambs in the Highlands of Scotland may be lost through still-births, malnutrition and hypothermia, only around 1% are lost to foxes. . (Ref: “Scavenging and predation upon sheep and lambs in West Scotland” by R Hewson and A F Leitch, Journal of Applied Ecology (1984) 21, 843-868).

Similar surveys by MAFF have led it to the conclusion that fox predation on lambs is “insignificant”.

Regarding the threat to chickens. The vast majority of chickens are sadly NOT free-range and so are "safe" from the fox.

I'll quote this again as well because obviously some people are choosing to ignore it:

"There is considerable misinformation on the need to control fox populations. There is in fact little evidence that foxes cause significant economic losses to agriculture, except locally. Professor Stephen Harris, from the University of Bristol, says that far from being pests, foxes actually perform a valuable service to farmers. "Seventy five per cent of the UK land area is in agricultural use. Twenty five per cent of this area is under crops. The fox can in no way be regarded as a pest on arable, dairy or beef farms. Foxes can even be beneficial by virtue of their diet of small mammals and rabbits which can damage crops and reduce available grazing.""

Now if ANY OF YOU can PROVE that the information I've posted here is incorrect, go ahead, because to me and surely anyone else, it clearly shows that foxes are an insignificant threat and thus the excuse of protecting livestock is a pathetic one.


quote:
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Originally posted by PlacidCasual Fences are not a solution to foxes.
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Even if that's true, neither is hunting! I've quoted the evidence to back up my claim. Can you provide anything to contradict me other than mere opinion and hearsay?


quote:
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Originally posted by PlacidCasual Why do I oppose a ban on fox hunting. The majority disliking something is not a good enough excuse to ban it. It flies in the face of the liberalism we have spent centuries instilling in our society.
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What about all the other grisly and cruel activities we banned? Would you like to bring back slavery, dog-fighting, badger-baiting etc.? Would you?


quote:
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Originally posted by PlacidCasual To make something illegal you must demonstrate that it harms the majority not to ban it.
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No, there may be many reasons including morality, etc.


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Originally posted by PlacidCasual On the issue of cruelty this is a good enough reason to ban something, but is impossible to prove that any of the alternative methods of fox control are less cruel. Shooting, gassing, poisoning you name it all are cruel and some are none selective.
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OK, so I'll suggest something which isn't as cruel - how about NOT killing foxesand letting them manage their own numbers?After all, I have shown that the hunt is ineffective at controlling fox numbers - its effect is negligible! So what's actually the point in continuing hunting?


quote:
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Originally posted by PlacidCasual The case has not been made to my satisfaction to ban this sport, distaste doesn't carry the arguement for me. The moment distaste does it may be the start of a long slippery road ending in the death of democracy as we know it.
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What you call "distaste" I and the MAJORITY of people call disgust".

I'll repost this again:

Over the last 30 years, independently conducted national opinion polls have regularly shown that a clear majority of the public not only disapprove of hunting with dogs but want to see it banned.

According to MORI, seven out of ten British people are in favour of a ban. This public opposition to hunting is not a town versus countryside issue. A Gallup poll conducted for The Daily Telegraph found that 77% of rural dwellers and 84% of urban dwellers disapprove of foxhunting.


'Phykell' Overclockers 2003

[xdam]

Posted by DF's no.1 numpty
'Phykell' Overclockers 2003

pleeeease, more shit comes from that board than a fucking cow farm.

90% of the country couldn't give a shit if there legs are ripped off or if there alive, just leave it, your not going to win anyone over here.

[wizer]

Originally posted by EeewocK

They cause damage to farmers crops due to them just running across them after the fox.

eeewock your views seem to be misinformed and not really anywhere near the truth. Farmers get PAID to ALLOw these hunts to take place. For the specific REASON that it puts money in their pocket, hence keeping the farming industry in this country alive AND clearing the countryside of vermin that attack the farmers livestock.

[wizer]

lefty: PLEASE STOP POSTING SHIT FROM THAT FUCKING BOARD!!!!!!

If you can't enter into the debate off your own views then don't bother. This guy (your homosexual partner?) has obviously brain washed you as you seem to just be repeating what he has said.

look at all the people shouting down your views on the other board, then have another look over here and it will show you how ill supported your views are

[ABCMan]

Originally posted by Leftfield
quote:
i LOVE animals and plants is this a bad thing????

not always, i love pussy and there are some plants i just cant seem to get enough of

but the only good fox is on a nice fox fur coat or stole


oh and I get in trouble for making long posts

[kjun]

It seems to me, that those opposing fox hunting, are in the minority on 'technology' based boards such as this one, boards which attract more intelligent people.

Hence using the power of statistics that I made up just (which seems to be the majority of evidence presented so far)

82% of intelligent people are against banning fox hunting
so therefore, i assume that

If you are against fox hunting, you are stupid

simple

[The Prodigy]

Over the last 30 years, independently conducted national opinion polls have regularly shown that a clear majority of the public not only disapprove of hunting with dogs but want to see it banned.

According to MORI, seven out of ten British people are in favour of a ban. This public opposition to hunting is not a town versus countryside issue. A Gallup poll conducted for The Daily Telegraph found that 77% of rural dwellers and 84% of urban dwellers disapprove of foxhunting.

[wizer]

lol but the only people bothering to vote are the smug hippy retards like you lefty

[wizer]

lefty... out of interest m8.. What do you do for a living?

[The Prodigy]

And do you know what the really funny thing is,, IT WILL BE BANNED just like dog fighting and badger baiting.

So all you curel fox hunters might as well start thinking about a new hobbie now !! LOL

[monsta]

kjun youre logic is flawfless m8

ABCMan, no offence sometimes youre long posts can be a little on the snoozy side, at least you can have fun on this one, picking it apart, or ripping it to shreads, but we shouldnt do this as ive got a feeling this thread may be sentient.

my take:

if people want to hunt, let them, i saw a fox the other night (in london) and thought it waas quite a smart lookin little fella, and if some little kids had started throwin rocks at it and stuff id have thrown rocks at them, but huntin in the country side where its the dogs that do the kill, or they are shot doesnt really bother me, it doesnt affect me or my life. if there was a vote id either not vote, or vote against a ban. thats just my opinion.

i respect that lefty and the intruder (is it against the rules to use other peoples logins? and whilst were at it what are the rules of df i couldnt find them anywhere). god youve got me rambling now.

i dont think anyone heres going to change there mind, some in favour, some against.

ps phukall, fences, lol.

pps, this thread moves faster than a chased fox, i started writtin it and by the time ive posted a load more posts have been added

ppps since editing 2 more posts were added!!!!!!!!

[wizer]

Originally posted by The Prodigy

So all you curel fox hunters might as well start thinking about a new hobbie now !! LOL

You are SO weird m8.. wtf does that mean? No one has said they go fox hunting in this thread? Are you mad?

[The Prodigy]

I'm a micro electronic test engineer for an emergency lighting company.

What's it too you?! And what relevance does that have with the subject?!

[monsta]

Originally posted by The Prodigy
I'm a micro electronic test engineer for an emergency lighting company.

What's it too you?! And what relevance does that have with the subject?!

well i hope youre not at work now, you obviously cant be doing much the amount youre typing in here

[wizer]

Originally posted by monsta
well i hope youre not at work now, you obviously cant be doing much the amount youre typing in here

He's prolly on the sick... Broken hearted over a dead fox

[The Prodigy]

''You are SO weird m8..''

That's funny, I'm weird yet someone that gets GREAT pleasure out of watching a defenceless animal being chased for hours and then ripped apart by a pack of dogs whilst it's still alive is NORMAL!! LOL LOL

Fox Hunting WILL be banned in under 2 years time and we will then take one step closer to being able to call ourselves a CIVILIZED society!!

[nickstan]

Just like to say I respect you standing up for what you believe in Prodigy. Especially when you post facts and then get non-sensical childish irrelevant replies. Cheers for the info.

[wizer]

Originally posted by nickstan
Just like to say I respect you standing up for what you believe in Prodigy. Especially when you post facts and then get non-sensical childish irrelevant replies. Cheers for the info.

ok you're going to have to back that up m8.. what facts are non-sensical? and is it non-sensical because it's wholly your view?

[xdam]

this thread is just wasting bandwidth, prodigy, if your not going to make valued points of your own don't bother with your argument, people are replying just for the sake of an argument you are most likely the only person in this thread who actually cares wheather fox hunting is banned or not.