'16 Killed As Israel Storms Aid Convoy'

[the.insane]

Are you seriously trying to educate me on History ?

To make sweeping statements like "The Israeli's have never had their back to the wall " is just plain stupid and I can smother that statement without any real effort at all.

Infact, I'm not going to do it all for you instead I'll just throw some years for you to research should wish to put some effort in.

1948
1956
1967
1973
and possibly 1982 could be included.

its pointless even arguing with you as you only seem to have a 1 track mind, those dates were dates of ware/conflicts where there was a balance of power, a fair fight as we prefer to call it, what israel is doing today can hardly be called a fair fight now can it ??

i think you will find that the majority of the people will agree with me in this thread than you, i dont even need to verbally attack you or call your posts rubbish, but in you doing so have already admitted defeat, maybe you dont have the honour to admit it. I will refuse to make any further comment in this thread as i see it pointless arguing with a brick wall who the majority of members on this forum know is wrong, but of course, you have perfect integrity, maybe you are the chosen one.


PS, why start from 1948, start from 1917 when the balfour declaration was signed,

The Balfour Declaration of 1917 (dated 2 November 1917) was a  formal statement of policy by the British  government stating that
 "His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in  Palestine of a national  home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavors to  facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood  that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious  rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights  and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."[1]

now maybe you better re-educate yourself

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour...ration_of_1917

maybe now you will realise why world war 2 was orchestrated to slaught many innocent jewish people, maybe so that the refugges could end in in palestine maybe? makes sense now doesnt it ??

oh and if you want to know about world war I, thats even easier, the strongest empire at the time was still the ottoman empire, this had to be weakened before the balfour treaty could be drawn up, yes, it goes that far back, not just 1948.

[4me2]

its pointless even arguing with you as you only seem to have a 1 track mind, those dates were dates of ware/conflicts where there was a balance of power, a fair fight as we prefer to call it, what israel is doing today can hardly be called a fair fight now can it ??

i think you will find that the majority of the people will agree with me in this thread than you, i dont even need to verbally attack you or call your posts rubbish, but in you doing so have already admitted defeat, maybe you dont have the honour to admit it. I will refuse to make any further comment in this thread as i see it pointless arguing with a brick wall who the majority of members on this forum know is wrong, but of course, you have perfect integrity, maybe you are the chosen one.

Fair fight and balance of power on those dates ? try 1973

The Yom Kippur War started with a surprise Arab attack on Israel on Saturday 6th October 1973. On this day, Egyptian and Syrian military forces launched an attack knowing that the military of Israel would be participating in the religious celebrations associated with Yom Kippur. Therefore, their guard would temporarily be dropped.
The combined forces of Egypt and Syria totalled the same number of men as NATO had in Western Europe. On the Golan Heights alone, 150 Israeli tanks faced 1,400 Syria tanks and in the Suez region just 500 Israeli soldiers faced 80,000 Egyptian soldiers.

Other Arab nations aided the Egyptians and Syrians. Iraq transferred a squadron of Hunter jet fighter planes to Egypt a few months before the war began. Iraqi Russian-built MIG fighters were used against the Israelis in the Golan Heights along with 18,000 Iraqi soldiers. Saudi Arabia and Kuwait effectively financed the war from the Arabs side. Saudi troops – approximately 3,000 men - also fought in the war. Libya provided Egypt with French-built Mirage fighters and in the years 1971 to 1973, Libya bankrolled Egypt’s military modernisation to the tune of $1 billion which was used to purchase modern Russian weapons. Other Arabic nations that helped the Egyptians and Syrians included Tunisia, Sudan and Morocco. Jordan also sent two armoured brigades and three artillery units to support the Syrians, but their participation in the war was not done with vast enthusiasm – probably because King Hussein of Jordan had not been kept informed of what Egypt and Syria planned.

Facing such an attack, the Israeli forces were initially swiftly overwhelmed. Within two days, the Egyptians had crossed the Suez Canal and moved up to 15 miles inland of the most advanced Israeli troops in the Sinai. Syrian troops advanced by the same distance into the strategic Golan Heights in north Israel. By the end of October 7th, the military signs were ominous for Israel.
However, on October 8th, Israeli forces, bolstered by called-up reserves, counter-attacked in the Sinai. They pushed back the Egyptian military and crossed the Suez Canal south of Ismailia. Here, the Israelis used the Suez-Cairo road to advance towards the Egyptian capital, Cairo, and got to within 65 miles of it.

The Israelis experienced similar success in the Golan Heights where the Syrian forces were pushed back and Israel re-captured lost land. Using the main road from Tiberias to Damascus, the Israelis got to within 35 miles of the Syrian capital.

Come back at me with some backed up credible points instead of copping out and playing the victim.

[4me2]

PS, why start from 1948, start from 1917 when the balfour declaration was signed,

The Balfour Declaration of 1917 (dated 2 November 1917) was a  formal statement of policy by the British  government stating that
 "His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in  Palestine of a national  home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavors to  facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood  that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious  rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights  and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."[1]

now maybe you better re-educate yourself

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour...ration_of_1917

maybe now you will realise why world war 2 was orchestrated to slaught many innocent jewish people, maybe so that the refugges could end in in palestine maybe? makes sense now doesnt it ??

oh and if you want to know about world war I, thats even easier, the strongest empire at the time was still the ottoman empire, this had to be weakened before the balfour treaty could be drawn up, yes, it goes that far back, not just 1948.

You fucking what ?

You seriously expect me to believe that world war 2 was purposely started by Hitler because he wanted all the Jews to go to Palestine ?

And WW1 had fuckall to do with Franz Ferdinand of Austria/Hungry being assasinated then ?

I'm sorry but that defies a dignified response and I'm certainly not even going to make an attempt.

Is this the sort shite that gets spouted to you by your local Cleric ?

[Robbo]

What will it take for the world to realise that Isreal are the most dangerous terrorists out there, they make Al Qaeda look like a bunch of schoolkids with a catapult.

Spot on.

Maybe 4me2 has is own agenda sticking up for Israels crimes over and over. Must of voted BNP by the sounds of it.

[4me2]

Spot on.

Maybe 4me2 has is own agenda sticking up for Israels crimes over and over. Must of voted BNP by the sounds of it.

Here we go again !

No decent argumentation so now I'm BNP.

I've advanced from BDL and Sun reader a couple of posts ago.

Come on, FFS read the crap that the.insane posted FFS ! it's beyond belief !

But I'm BNP/BDL and Sun reader.

The future of this Country is secured looking at the standard of education being displayed by the younger generation.

[rudey]

You fucking what ?

You seriously expect me to believe that world war 2 was purposely started by Hitler because he wanted all the Jews to go to Palestine ?

And WW1 had fuckall to do with Franz Ferdinand of Austria/Hungry being assasinated then ?

I'm sorry but that defies a dignified response and I'm certainly not even going to make an attempt.

Is this the sort shite that gets spouted to you by your local Cleric ?

THATS THE KIND OF STUFF WHICH SEPARATES THE HATERS FROM THE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO MAKE AN INTELIGENT THREAD , ALL YOU HAVE DONE IN THE LAST FEW THREADS IS PROVE WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT IS THAT YOU HAVE A DEEP SEATED RESENTMENT FOR MUSLIMS, IN YOU LAST FEW THREADS ALL IT HAS BEEN IS CLERIC/ISLAMASIST/I LOVE ISRAEL....... ( EVEN THOUGH I AM A GENTILE )

THIS THREAD SHOULDNT HAVE BEEN ABOUT MUSLIMS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN ABOUT DISPROPORTIONATE RESPONCE BY THE ISRAELI ARMY AGAINST ACTIVISTS BREAKIING THE SIEGE OF GAZA WHICH HAS LASTED 4 YEARS IN WHICH TIME NOTHING IS ALLOWED IN BY LAND OR SEAS ( HENCE THE TUNNELS IN EGYPT FROM WHERE EVERYTHING COMES IN INC ARMS LIVESTOCK MEDICINE ETC)
FROM RAFAH IN EGYPT ONLY MEDICINES ARE ALLOWED FROM THE ISRAELI CHECKPOINTS ALL OTHER STUFF IS ALLOWED BUT THE FOODSTUFF ARE SPOLIED AND ALL OTHER THINGS ARE DESTROYED SO YOU HAVE 1.5 MILLION PEOPLE LIVING WITH NOT MUCH .... WHY ?????????? BECAUSE THEY VOTED DEMOCRATICLY ???
IM NOT GOING INTO WAR CRIMES ETC.... IT WOULD TAKE TOO LONG
FROM STEALING ORGANS FROM DEAD PALESTINIANS TO SEXUAL ABUSE OF MINORS BY ISRAELI SOILDERS UNDER DETENTION ... THE LIST IS ENDLESS ......

ISRAEL = AN ILEGAL STATE RUN BY CRIMINALS ( 1967 BORDERS APROVED BY U.N)
PROVE ME WRONG !!!

[DelTrotter]

Spot on.

Maybe 4me2 has is own agenda sticking up for Israels crimes over and over. Must of voted BNP by the sounds of it.

Israel are nothing, just a legitmate country given its rightful place in the middle east to make the people of islam suffer.
Fuck em im with the USA and the controllers we have to be

[4me2]

THATS THE KIND OF STUFF WHICH SEPARATES THE HATERS FROM THE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO MAKE AN INTELIGENT THREAD , ALL YOU HAVE DONE IN THE LAST FEW THREADS IS PROVE WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT IS THAT YOU HAVE A DEEP SEATED RESENTMENT FOR MUSLIMS, IN YOU LAST FEW THREADS ALL IT HAS BEEN IS CLERIC/ISLAMASIST/I LOVE ISRAEL....... ( EVEN THOUGH I AM A GENTILE )

THIS THREAD SHOULDNT HAVE BEEN ABOUT MUSLIMS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN ABOUT DISPROPORTIONATE RESPONCE BY THE ISRAELI ARMY AGAINST ACTIVISTS BREAKIING THE SIEGE OF GAZA WHICH HAS LASTED 4 YEARS IN WHICH TIME NOTHING IS ALLOWED IN BY LAND OR SEAS ( HENCE THE TUNNELS IN EGYPT FROM WHERE EVERYTHING COMES IN INC ARMS LIVESTOCK MEDICINE ETC)
FROM RAFAH IN EGYPT ONLY MEDICINES ARE ALLOWED FROM THE ISRAELI CHECKPOINTS ALL OTHER STUFF IS ALLOWED BUT THE FOODSTUFF ARE SPOLIED AND ALL OTHER THINGS ARE DESTROYED SO YOU HAVE 1.5 MILLION PEOPLE LIVING WITH NOT MUCH .... WHY ?????????? BECAUSE THEY VOTED DEMOCRATICLY ???
IM NOT GOING INTO WAR CRIMES ETC.... IT WOULD TAKE TOO LONG
FROM STEALING ORGANS FROM DEAD PALESTINIANS TO SEXUAL ABUSE OF MINORS BY ISRAELI SOILDERS UNDER DETENTION ... THE LIST IS ENDLESS ......

ISRAEL = AN ILEGAL STATE RUN BY CRIMINALS ( 1967 BORDERS APROVED BY U.N)
PROVE ME WRONG !!!

When all over the news you hear the call to muslims all over the world to unite against Israel you cannot say it has nothing to do with muslims.

I disagree with all religions and think they should be banned as I have stated on many occasions but ofcourse you chose to ignore this.

Once again because you cant counter with any validity then you brand me as being antimuslim but this shouldn't be an issue for you if what you saying is true.

[the.insane]

Once again because you cant counter with any validity then you brand me as being antimuslim but this shouldn't be an issue for you if what you saying is true.

could you do a quick search for me and show me where your last pro-muslim thread is/was..........please.

[4me2]

could you do a quick search for me and show me where your last pro-muslim thread is/was..........please.

I have never made one, but by the same token I have never made a pro Christian, pro jewish, pro Buddist, pro Sikh or pro Jedi for that matter.

I'm just happy to have all religions exposed as they the cause of most of the World's misery.

Just when I post something about a Catholic priest being found to be a paedo I don't get accused of being Racist, a BDL member or a Sun reader.

But wow betide anyone saying anything against Islam, then sooner or later everything gets blown out of all proportion and fake outrage and mass hysteria rules the day.

[4me2]

who the f*cks talking to you sunshine ??, if i want your opinion i'll shout SHIT

edit.

just seen Del's deleted post.

He can disappear for a month.

[the.insane]

why dont we have a simple poll, anonymous poll of course, only 2 options, was israel wrong or was israel right, maybe we will see which way the poll favours, as my opinion and your doesnt doesnt really mean shit as we can argue here forever and a day and still not have a result.

[Bald Bouncer]

Posts Deleted:
Enough with the crap, keep it on topic

[the.insane]

You keep a civil tongue in your head !

Prove that you can debate in a civil manner.

Now because you can't be objective you show aggression.

Fine example you are setting.

look at his remarks first, that answer was well deserved, i didnt ask him a question, i asked you, which you respectfully answered, enough said.

[Bald Bouncer]

why dont we have a simple poll, anonymous poll of course, only 2 options, was israel wrong or was israel right, maybe we will see which way the poll favours, as my opinion and your doesnt doesnt really mean shit as we can argue here forever and a day and still not have a result.

But that's exactly what is going to happen, I have a very strong opinion on this but choose not to get drawn into arguments in a thread on it as it is so emotive you will never convince the people you are arguing with of your view or that they are wrong so at best you post information backed up with links and try and convince others.

[the.insane]

But that's exactly what is going to happen, I have a very strong opinion on this but choose not to get drawn into arguments in a thread on it as it is so emotive you will never convince the people you are arguing with of your view or that they are wrong so at best you post information backed up with links and try and convince others.

i dont see why anybody on here should fall out with each other, its not as if we can change anything.

[4me2]

why dont we have a simple poll, anonymous poll of course, only 2 options, was israel wrong or was israel right, maybe we will see which way the poll favours, as my opinion and your doesnt doesnt really mean shit as we can argue here forever and a day and still not have a result.

As far as I can see nothing has been established yet.

We know people are dead but conflicting information on what happened after the IDF landed on one of the boats.

From what I can see is there was only trouble on one of the boats.

[4me2]

Navy commandos describe takeover of the Mavi Marmara.


“They came for war,” was how one Israeli Navy commando described the activists aboard the Mavi Marmara Turkish passenger boat where clashes erupted early Monday morning and ended with at least nine activists dead and dozens others, including eight IDF soldiers, injured.

“Operation Sea Breeze”, as it was called by the IDF, actually began several hours earlier at about 11 pm Sunday night as the Navy made its initial contact with the Mavi Marmara and the other five ships which were part of an international aid flotilla on its way to try and break the Israel-imposed sea blockade on Gaza.

After several hours of radio communications and warnings that the Mavi Marmara would be boarded if the captain did not change his ship’s course, at 4 am Monday, OC Navy Vice-Admiral Eliezer “Cheney” Marom, who had set up a command post on the INS Victory, gave the order to Flotilla 13 to board the ship.

The three Israeli Air Force Blackhawk Helicopters hovering nearby made their approach above the Mavi Marmara’s upper deck. Sitting on board, the naval commandos could just make out the few dozen activists gathered below. Carrying non-lethal weapons as well as pistols, the last thing the soldiers thought they would walk into was a well-planed lynch.

“As the 15 of us slid down the ropes, 30 of them were waiting for us on the deck,” one of the commandos later told reporters. “They charged us and threw a few of the soldiers off the deck to the floor below. We did not expect to find ourselves in such a situation.”

The assessment within the Navy was that the activists would resist the Israeli takeover of their ship but along the lines of the demonstrations the IDF faces weekly in the West Bank where Palestinians protest against the security barrier. Rocks and punches would be thrown as well as an occasional knife but not the extent of violence they met.

As the rope fell from the helicopter onto the Mavi Marmara’s deck, some of the Turkish activists grabbed it, tied it to an antenna likely hoping that it would bring down the helicopter. The Navy commandos decided to still go ahead with the operation and began sliding down onto the ship.

Armed with rifles that could shoot paintballs – which can hurt but not kill – the soldiers landed on the ship and immediately came under attack by dozens of activists armed with knives, bats and metal pipes. Activists grabbed soldiers and tried to hold them hostage, stripping them of their helmets and equipment.

One of the soldiers tried to protect a commando who was being lynched by a group of activists. They were instructed by the flotilla commander to refrain from using their sidearm unless their lives were at risk.

Soldiers feared for their lives, asked permission to open fire

The force threw several stun grenades but the violent attacks continued. Two soldiers were injured and some of the activists succeeded in stealing one of the soldier’s guns. Shots were fired and one of the soldiers fell to the ground unconscious. Fearing for their lives, the soldiers asked and received permission to open fire, first taking aim at the activists’ feet.

In one corner of the ship, the commandos saw a gun flash. They returned fire and started chasing the shooter but could not find him.

As the clashes intensified, additional commandos boarded the ship as well as members of the Border Police’s Yasam unit who are experts in riot control and crowd dispersion. After less than an hour, the ship was in Israeli hands. The price though was steep – eight soldiers were injured, several of them seriously and at least nine activists were killed

By the evening, the naval commandos were back at their base in northern Israel and had begun their debriefing.

The videos taken by the IDF were passed around throughout the defense establishment and made their way to other special forces, including the Israel Police’s elite counter-terror unit Yamam, which had fought to participate in the mission but had been left on the sidelines due to legal complications involving police operations out at sea.

“The soldiers acted with the utmost nobility,” said one police source close to the Yamam. “They engaged in hand-to-hand combat, sustained injuries, but only opened fire after one of them was lying on the ground unconscious and two others had been shot. This was an unbelievable demonstration of restraint.”

http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=177040


Take it or leave but I can't see why it wouldn't have happened as described above.

Apparently theres some new video footage doing the rounds that may show more.

I'll keep a look out for it.

[rudey]

we all have opinions and thats as far as it has gone, one person banned from here for giving his view is kinda no diffrent from regimes in some countries where you would have disapeared overnight for having a diffrent view than the leaders in certain less free countrys
will wait with baited breath to hear stories from the BRITISH activists to get more of a picture , i wonder how they will be treated ? will this whole thing turn nasty and the arabs turn of the oil tap to the west like in
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_oil_crisis

[4me2]

we all have opinions and thats as far as it has gone, one person banned from here for giving his view is kinda no diffrent from regimes in some countries where you would have disapeared overnight for having a diffrent view than the leaders in certain less free countrys
will wait with baited breath to hear stories from the BRITISH activists to get more of a picture , i wonder how they will be treated ? will this whole thing turn nasty and the arabs turn of the oil tap to the west like in
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_oil_crisis

He was banned for being damned right abusive to the.insane not for any views he had.

I doubt they will turn off the oil tap as places like Abu Dabi are in financial crisis too.

It wouldn't surprise me though, if the markets don't use this an excuse to bang up the price, like when news of Euro weakening appears.

Fuel prices have actually dropped in my area over the last week or so.