Returning soldiers heckled by Muslim protesters in Dagenham

[CzarJunkie]

In fact no, they sign up to protect UK population and the oath says.......

The Oath of Allegiance on joining the Army.

I swear by Almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, her heirs and successors and that I will as in duty bound honestly and faithfully defend Her Majesty, her heirs and successors in person, crown and dignity against all enemies and will observe and obey all orders of Her Majesty, her heirs and successors and of the generals and officers set over me.

.

They sign up to the armed forces, forget the oath, thats bollocks. If you don't think you're going to see action then more fool the poor c*nt who is conned into siging up.

Having said all that, looking at the Oath, if that was read out to me on the parade ground I'd tell the Sgt Mgr to stick it up his arse and double time out the fucking gate. The last thing I'd do is do anything for those German c*nts.

[Realist]

And thats where your UK loyalties die and showing your true colours to the UK people, the very country where you live and breath.

You'll look back one day and see the errors your creating but its your views and life.

Enjoy it.

[CzarJunkie]

And thats where your UK loyalties die and showing your true colours to the UK people, the very country where you live and breath.

You'll look back one day and see the errors your creating but its your views and life.

Enjoy it.

The Queen is German and her husband is Greek. If you really want to get into loyalties, as a Celt I have absolutley no loyalty to those cunts. My tribe were here long before them.

[BBK]

Although they are all trained to fight there main aim to to protect country, persons life.

Explain to me how ANY soldier fighting in Afghanistan is protecting me, the country or indeed your precious queen?

Im ex forces and it hurts me when I see my fellow soldiers being called names and when people call what they do as unjust.

Then don't fight in unjust and illegal campaigns of terror. Pretty simple really.

People in this country specially those that complain needed our armed forces to protect them at the time of need and if the said forces didnt do there job those that complained will then complain about another argument.

The last time of need we had, 65 years ago, saw the people who fought RIGHTLY given hero status, but lets be honest, it was pretty much everyone, not just the army. There has not been a single case during my life when I have needed protecting by the army. You may well turn around and cite Ireland, and I would concede that you would have an argument, but lets not get into the actions of the British Army in Ireland, not days after the Bloody Sunday report shall we.

Those people that showed disrespect to my fellow comrads should realise they live here, bring up families here and are quite happy taking our jobs and money.

So? If someone did something you didn't like would you ignore it just because they lived here? As far as I'm concerned none of your "comrads" deserve anything other than criticism, because maybe thats the only way they will understand that what they are doing is just plain wrong.

If these people are not happy then simple solution is go back to the country they are protesting about but they'll never do that because they know where there bread is buttered.

Where do you propose I go? I'm English and white. No, its people like YOU that need to head off, people who don't have the ability to see that they are being lied to and fall for the propoganda hook, line and sinker.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but do so correctly.

Exactly right. But your definition of correct is very different to mine, so then what? One of us is wrong, one of us is right. You believe its you, I clearly don't. I would wager I could back my reasoning up far better than you, because quite frankly you don't actually have a leg to stand on other than the religious bullshit that the media have tried to feed us.

I felt so proud of those soldiers for marching with pride for themselves, families and fallen comrads.

What do they have to be proud about? That they have taken to murdering innocent people for no apparent reason? Where is the pride in that? They should feel utterly, utterly ashamed with their actions. In times of true war or indeed a point where they are protecting this country I would be the first standing up applauding them, because I know they are doing something I really would not want to do, I wouldn't want to put myself in the firing line for this country. However, what we are doing in Afghanistan is an utter travesty and tantamount to murder in my eyes.

[4me2]

I'm glad I took the time to reply now and that people have so eagerly acknowledged my post and it's points.

More dancing (around the issues) here than in Saturday night fever.

[jacko1]

What do they have to be proud about? That they have taken to murdering innocent people for no apparent reason? Where is the pride in that? They should feel utterly, utterly ashamed with their actions. In times of true war or indeed a point where they are protecting this country I would be the first standing up applauding them, because I know they are doing something I really would not want to do, I wouldn't want to put myself in the firing line for this country. However, what we are doing in Afghanistan is an utter travesty and tantamount to murder in my eyes.

Innocent people? Are you having a laugh? Innocent people don't fly planes into buildings, Innocent people don't grow and sell opium, Innocent people don't hack off the heads of ordinary people, Innocent people don't treat thier women and girls like trash and innocent people don't string up 7 year old children for being spys. I hope you never have the pleasure of bumping into these muslim fanatics as i am sure you would soon change your tune.

[CzarJunkie]

Innocent people? Are you having a laugh? Innocent people don't fly planes into buildings, Innocent people don't grow and sell opium, Innocent people don't hack off the heads of ordinary people, Innocent people don't treat thier women and girls like trash and innocent people don't string up 7 year old children for being spys. I hope you never have the pleasure of bumping into these muslim fanatics as i am sure you would soon change your tune.

Being a Liverpool fan I never had you down as a Sun reader, but with that shite you could write for them.

[Ginnerfreak]

racist... yada yada yada,
freedom of speach... yada yada yada..
war in Afghanistan is wrong.. yada yada yada.
its all about the BNP... yada yada yada..
your a sun reader... yada yada yada..
England has gone to the dogs..

FFS.. every thread on this forum seems to turn into the same discussion.. its like groundhog day!

I am sure some of you just use cut and paste from other discussions..

[jacko1]

Being a Liverpool fan I never had you down as a Sun reader, but with that shite you could write for them.

So none of thats true then? Did i imagine those 2 planes flying into buildings? Was i dreaming that Ken bigley had his head hacked off? Maybe thats how you treat woman in yorkshire
but we don't here in Liverpool, I suppose they're daffodils they're growing, And of course they wouldn't hang children for spying much like they wouldn't use them as suicide bombers, Mate i can assure you i don't read the sun and never will but i think you may have forgotten your mining town roots.

[Mystical_2K]

is it getting warm in here?

alot of this is getting out of hand, i think alot of the points raised here (and the main one) is that people dont seem to have a problem with people protesting but its the manner in which they did it, they should have done this outside number 10 not when the guys are marching through the streets celebrating the fact they have returned home, also its got nothing to do with religion/race (in my opinion, as im pissed off at what they did rather than who they are) as i would have been just as pissed off with them had they been from any other religion/race, their is a time and a place for this sort of thing

i am not a supporter of the war in afghanistan or all the other "war on terror", "war on drugs" etc etc they keep chucking at us as some justification for basically getting what they want, cloaking it in a story and basically going and taking what they want. It sickens me that innocent people are gunned down everyday and more maimed, the amount of people and children that die daily truly makes me feel sick when i think about it, these things are engineered at a level so much higher than the average soldier, its the big-wigs in the offices making these decisions, the soldiers go out their and fight for what they believe is right using the information they are told, they are doing it to protect this country because without them i truly think we would end up with a lot more problems than we have right now

I doubt the vast majority of soldiers enjoy having to kill people, maybe the very odd one who is some sort of glory hunter but alot of people i have known to be in the armed forces in some respect have all been good people who you would never believe would be capable of holding a weapon or hurting someone, its a part of the job, yes you can say that they knew that when they signed up but seriously do you really think thats why they took the job? their are so many other aspects to being in the armed forces (its generally well paid, gives you a proper career, you get a sense of worth knowing you are doing something to help your country as opposed to all the dole dossers that wouldnt take a job if it was offered to them), some feel that they need the discipline the army provides.

You can say all you want about the war being unjust etc etc but remember that the soldiers do what they are told, they dont make the decisions to invade countries or start wars but they are expected to follow orders, once they are in a combat zone i cant blame anyone for defending themselves and obviously in war people are going to get hurt and some killed, its a horrible truth of war unfortunately.

i personally could not do what these guys do, i would literally shit myself at the thought of it, i have alot of respect for anyone who can.

[CzarJunkie]

Maybe thats how you treat woman in yorkshire.

We treat them well, as long as they behave. If not, who knows, I've been known to kick them in the snatch if they back chat. In more serious situations I've seen friends remove labia with a lock knife and wear it like a trophy. I don't think that's the answer, but they do have some fucking chelp.

[Mystical_2K]

erm this is a serious discussion (Supposedly) can you pair put your handbags down for 2 fuckin minutes please

[CzarJunkie]

erm this is a serious discussion (Supposedly) can you pair put your handbags down for 2 fuckin minutes please

There hasn't been a serious discussion here in years.

[Greyfox]

Innocent people? Are you having a laugh? Innocent people don't grow and sell opium

http://www.nowpublic.com/world/after...3-worlds-opium

[4me2]

http://www.nowpublic.com/world/after...3-worlds-opium

Thats what I was saying in my post but people aren't interested in addressing that.

Far bigger things are at stake in this thread namely people's inflated egos.

[jacko1]

http://www.nowpublic.com/world/after...3-worlds-opium

Ill give you that one mate but what about the others?

[Realist]

Explain to me how ANY soldier fighting in Afghanistan is protecting me, the country or indeed your precious queen?

Because if it was not for our armed forces and armed forces from other countries we would be looking at 9/11 and other problems here in the uk and all over the world.

Then don't fight in unjust and illegal campaigns of terror. Pretty simple really.

Nothing wrong with fighting for the rights of law abiding citizens whom dont go around killing people because they dont follow a poxy book called the koran.

The last time of need we had, 65 years ago, saw the people who fought RIGHTLY given hero status, but lets be honest, it was pretty much everyone, not just the army. There has not been a single case during my life when I have needed protecting by the army. You may well turn around and cite Ireland, and I would concede that you would have an argument, but lets not get into the actions of the British Army in Ireland, not days after the Bloody Sunday report shall we.

As I said there will be a day when you'll be shouting for the needs of the british forces to protect the likes of you and I hope they say fcku off.

So? If someone did something you didn't like would you ignore it just because they lived here? As far as I'm concerned none of your "comrads" deserve anything other than criticism, because maybe thats the only way they will understand that what they are doing is just plain wrong.

As I've stated above they are doing nothing wrong but protecting my way of life, lives of others, those of the country they are protecting.

You should look at the adults that train there kids to throw stones at our soldiers, blow them up with IED's and get there kids to walk up to there convoys with vests on.

But no thats ok.

Where do you propose I go? I'm English and white. No, its people like YOU that need to head off, people who don't have the ability to see that they are being lied to and fall for the propoganda hook, line and sinker.

Lied to, I've fucking seen it you fucking knob so tell me Im being lied to

Exactly right. But your definition of correct is very different to mine, so then what? One of us is wrong, one of us is right. You believe its you, I clearly don't. I would wager I could back my reasoning up far better than you, because quite frankly you don't actually have a leg to stand on other than the religious bullshit that the media have tried to feed us.

So all those soldiers with no legs, arms come back in coffins are all lies by the media just to give ammunition to causes that you support.

Get real.

What do they have to be proud about? That they have taken to murdering innocent people for no apparent reason? Where is the pride in that? They should feel utterly, utterly ashamed with their actions. In times of true war or indeed a point where they are protecting this country I would be the first standing up applauding them, because I know they are doing something I really would not want to do, I wouldn't want to put myself in the firing line for this country. However, what we are doing in Afghanistan is an utter travesty and tantamount to murder in my eyes.

I'm proud they are fighting a just cause, in protecting the lives of my family, friends and people of the country they are fighting in.

Its people like you that want to see what its like in the real world and its not all black and white but forces that have a agenda on making this and other countries Muslim.

[BBK]

Because if it was not for our armed forces and armed forces from other countries we would be looking at 9/11 and other problems here in the uk and all over the world.

Oh how naive. How incredibly naive. Ask yourself this. What do you think led people to resort to flying planes into the twin towers? And do you not think the hundreds of thousands of Afghan and Iraqi dead have paid the price?

Nothing wrong with fighting for the rights of law abiding citizens whom dont go around killing people because they dont follow a poxy book called the koran.

Naive AND intolerant. Basically you're following the doctrine that if someone doesn't want to live their lives the way YOU want them to its ok to kill them. I don't subscribe to that. Its thinking like that that has caused this fucking mess in the first place.

As I said there will be a day when you'll be shouting for the needs of the british forces to protect the likes of you and I hope they say fcku off.

Hang on, I pay their wages, they should protect me. But lets be honest, as I pointed out above, none of them have done for 65 years now, and I seriously doubt this nation will ever be invaded again. Actually, its what, 950 years now since we were invaded IIRC.

As I've stated above they are doing nothing wrong but protecting my way of life, lives of others, those of the country they are protecting.

Bullshit. Those people had a way of life. It just wasn't the one the Americans wanted them to have, so they invaded and dragged us in with them. Tell me HOW they are protecting your way of life. Its garbage. They are not. They are out there because they are told to be there, they shoot and kill who they are told to shoot and kill.

You should look at the adults that train there kids to throw stones at our soldiers, blow them up with IED's and get there kids to walk up to there convoys with vests on.

The world is a horrible place, and adults do horrible things to kids. Its pretty well acknowledged that most child abuse happens in the home, so in our society we are using our own children for sexual pleasure, in theirs they are using them to fight a war. Which of those sounds more acceptable to you? Its a sick world, truly, but it works on both sides.

Lied to, I've fucking seen it you fucking knob so tell me Im being lied to

What have you seen? You've seen fighting? Bully for you. Thats so not the point - but then, I'm guessing maybe you struggle to see that. You and your ilk CREATED the fight by going over there, invading, and murdering innocent people. Sticking your noses in where its not wanted. Which in turn only creates even more discontent and hatred.

Ask yourself this. Why is there a "war" in Afghanistan?

So all those soldiers with no legs, arms come back in coffins are all lies by the media just to give ammunition to causes that you support.

What has that got to do with anything? No one is saying British troops aren't getting killed. I think its tragic that they are being maimed and killed in an illegal and unjust war, and if you care so much for their wellbeing than surely you should support that point of view? I'm not so stupid as to believe everything I read in the media, but I don't believe they make this shit up. Shame that we don't consider the 100,000 or more Afghans and Iraqis those same troops have murdered, but I guess thats wr isn\t it, written by the winners as they say. You probably don't give a shit about the value of their lives, whereas I do. We are committing murder, they are protecting their homeland. They are only terrorists because we labelled them so.

I'm proud they are fighting a just cause, in protecting the lives of my family, friends and people of the country they are fighting in.

Proud of what? Explain to me how it is just to invade another country. Explain to me why we invaded that country. Give me some fucked up and factually incorrect answer about the koran, Islam etc, and how they are all terrorists. Explain to me what gives us the right to go into someone elses country without being asked, just to find one terrorist, and still be there almost 10 years later murdering the local peoples.

Its people like you that want to see what its like in the real world and its not all black and white but forces that have a agenda on making this and other countries Muslim.

See here's the irony. I live in the real world. No-one is trying to make this country muslim, least of all the muslims who live here. I wonder how many muslims you actually personally know, and how many of them you know want to turn this county islamic, because all the muslims I know just want to be left to practice their PEACEFUL faith in quiet, comfort and respect. And you know what? I'd rather give them the time of day than someone who doesn't want to see what is real, to see that murder isn't the solution, that illegal and unjust invasions of other countries is not the right thing to do. Someone who just believes the media propoganda about how the Islamic world is out to get us all, and introduce sharia law. Its just not like that, its simply not true.

[DavidF]

I think the right to protest should be withdrawn when it concerns public order. Demo's should have to be applied for and permission given on a case by case buisness. And before the "Free Speech" brigade start whinging then let me just say that IMHO there is NO such thing as free speech....never has been never will be. You can say what you like in private but what you say in public must and should conform to societies rules.

Now for my 2nd point - It's all very well all the armchair critics going on about ileagle war/immoral war ect ect ect. Lets just get 1 thing perfectly clear USA are the playground bully here and we ARE there bitches.....may be a bitter pill to swallow but hey that's just the way it is.......I respectfully sujest people get over the fact that we cannot get by alone, We as a country need allies and who better than the USA ? Again we are a natural partnership....albeit they have the control but again they are the powerhouse and that's the way it is.......So when the USA say's to Tony Blair ...."We're gonna invade Afghanistan and we could do with your backing"......Roughly translated that means Back us or the "marriage" is over. So he say's yes on our behalf in return for a few scraps from the top table......And so would ANY other person who was Prime Minister of this country at that time.....It doesn't pay to piss off your major allies ffs.
Point No.2 - Like it or not we are like the USA in many ways including using oil like there is no tomorrow. So yeah the wars and invasions are about oil.......where the fook do you think we would be without it ? You just need to listen to peoples reactions when the fuel price goes up and they go mental....imagine what it would be like if the fanatics had control of the stuff....ffs there would be anarchy and nobody would be replying to this post as they most probably wouldn't have any electricity to power there pc....because of the enormous cost of the "Black Gold"
I could go on ALL night about what it would be like if we let these backward fuckwits keep control of their own oil....ffs. It is a fluke of nature that the major oil reserves have all ended up mainly in the middle east.....It's like god's final joke on us all. Lets put 80% of the worlds oil in a part of the world where they have neither the brains nor desire to use it and lets see the rest of the world fight over how to get control of it........the top man must be laughing his ass off sitting on his big cloud up there.

Anyway Ive strayed off topic here and for that im sorry but the main point stands - These guys are defending OUR way of life no matter how unpalatable that may be for any of you. They do a thankless task and TBH I think they are hero's due to what they have to go through to make sure I can consume consume and consume some more.

[blaggard]

Lets leave the personal insults OUT please or you'll be excluded from the thread.