Looking for critique

[Little John]

OK I have been getting used to the 1DIV for the last few weeks, not under the best conditions (indoor cricket and a few parties in almost darkness) but hey the camera works well up to 6400 ISO so has been fun to use.

Anyway I have been chatting with a local guy who makes his living from photography I have known him for ages as he shoots at the Reebok and down at Burnden Park, I love his old photos from Burnden park etc. He was at the cricket I was shooting today again He has been up at Horwich and a few other places I have shot at, today we got chatting and he pretty much said I am doing it all wrong, my photos are crap I have the washing in the backgrounds I should be cropping tighter, my exposure is all wrong and that I need to work on that and I am relying on the camera to do the work, there is no detail in the shadows especially when cricketers are wearing hats well yeah it creates a shadow if the main light source is from above he went on about how I should adjust the exposure to bring out the detail in the shadow areas. I was thinking OK I will take a look at his work in more detail and see what I should be doing, I had found his sales site a few weeks ago and something didn't quite look right with the images but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. Well after his comments today I can see what he means by adjusting the exposure on the faces. We have people with white faces and brown arms to give you an idea.

He also said I put too many photos on line and he is right, I like to put anything I like up and give people a choice rather than be more selective and put the best one or 2 images of each player, some games of cricket you only get to see 2 guys in bat so yeah not much choice for variety of people on there and I don't really want to upload 4 images. Adult cricket rarely sells anyway its the kids stuff that most of the money comes from and I shoot the adult games to get in and around the cricket clubs in the hope of shooting the junior games plain and simple.

I also notice he crops/fills the frame very tight I prefer to compose the shots to give some idea of what is going on or to give the person space to run in to if they are running or looking to the side what ever. Cropping his way is fine I suppose if you only list 3:2 prints but I allow other ratios as buying 8x6 frames is easier than a 9x6 frame so I need to leave space top and bottom for that ratio.

Anyway so the critique request my sales site is hosted by image partner accessible by www.jpephotography.com what does everyone think of what I am producing? All customers have been happy, yes there are a few duffers on there, I should be more selective to what I put up and I have been more selective as time goes on, looking at the older games there are plenty of issues, backgrounds and shooting with the light in the wrong place etc but I believe that my work has improved the problem is you rarely get decent critique from freinds and family they all think I am wonderful which is great to hear but not great when I am wanting to know what I am doing wrong in the attempt to improve so the chat with the guy today was a little confusing/enlightening and shall we say upsetting when I thought my work was improving to be shot down by someone I had built up respect for over the years as a photographer telling me my work was crap. He did offer to help me improve which I will take up and take on his comments getting that type of help in any profession/hobby is a huge thing. I don't think his comments were due to me being the new commer shooting what he has pretty much had a monolopy on in the area for sales to players and the local press for years? I havn't sent anything to the press btw.

I don't think it is fair to post his site as he isn't about to comment but I would greatly appreciate anything you have to say on what I am producing and where you think I could improve. Thanks

[muttleymacclad]

Hi John

Just a couple of thoughts from an initial look at your site.

1. When one goes from your homepage to an event, the title of event on that events page doesn't look professional enough eg slanted, grey drop shadows. I'd prefer it to be solid black and a bit more bold if you follow my drift.

2. On these events pages there's no really obvious "return to homepage" button, you have to click on the link back to your website.

3. Regarding the photo's.
Indoor cricket shots - very tough to get these right given your lighting. I would agree about cropping much tighter though - some have got pictures of batsman and wicketkeeper, where the keeper is pulling a face. (You probably wouldn't want that on your wall at home) Loose the wicket keeper if you can re-position yourself but not easy i guess.

The bowler shots - again you've got a fielder in the background of a lot of shots, this takes your 'focus' away from the main subject.

With the cropping of all these shots i tend to agree that you have too much wall etc in the background. I always remember something i read somewhere that goes along the lines of "Get closer and then get closer still!"

As well as getting tighter in, don't be afraid to concentrate on head shots or head and torso shots. Most images of sportsmen only have their head and shoulders in the shot. Obviously have a mix of full body shots and head shots but it's hard to tell who the batsmen are otherwise. (In the Prom shots you've cropped them very well.)

3. Your event shots - eg Reebok stadium. Again nice images but would have been better with a backdrop (You've used one at the prom event) - too much is going on in the background. Most event toggers have a backdrop and get the guests to stand in front of it. I wouldn't buy an image of myself at an event with some unknown person obvious in the background.

Thats a bit waffly but hope it helps from the p.o.v of an amateur togger and a prospective buyer.

I wish i could get off my arse and do what your doing though, so keep going.

mml

[BertRoot]

He is right. Cropping is key in sports shots, background doesn't matter when someone wants it in a frame to show off their prowess.

Another observation on your BW Lifeline Party is that most of the pictures have something shite in that background that ruins them. Its a common mistake that you will think more about as your skills improve but I would look at that one as a matter of urgency. last shot on the second row on page 2 is a sterling example. Nice capture of the guy with some gurning old trotter walking past. You ain't doing us Northerners any favours you know

[muttleymacclad]

last shot on the second row on page 2 is a sterling example. Nice capture of the guy with some gurning old trotter walking past. You ain't doing us Northerners any favours you know

ahh, but Bert, the old dear is only getting her own back for what the bloke was doing 2 shots earlier!

mml

[{{909}}]

I'm no expert on sports photography but if I was in your position I'd go to waterstones or a library and look at some cricket books, see how the photos are in there and try to copy that. The pro may have some good points but he also may have differing ideas to other pros. I tried to shoot a cricket match a few years ago and I found the fact that everyone stands in the same place and does virtually the same thing for the majority of the game incredibly tedious and uninspiring, so going in close may be the only way to create effective photography.

[Little John]

Thanks MML, Bert and 909 for taking time out to have a look for and comment for me.

The site design isn't mine, its the image partner skin and yes its crap, I have been working on something better but it is finding the time to finish things off. Image partner allow you to change the skin for £100 I think it was last time I looked so it fits in with my site design (I just don't have a site yet) I have had 2 people do work for me on a site take the money and then go on a slow down and never really do anything the image partner thing was an emergency thing where I needed to get photos on line in a selling environment and it works but needs improving.

As 909 says, cricketers rarely move unless the ball comes their way they always return to their start points for the delivery and walk closer in as the bowler runs up so you get legs in the back ground and this was the indoor so apart from the 5 windows on the balcony no room for movement unless you really want to look down on them. Outdoor games I can move about a lot more so yes I can look at the background and make sure it isn't there, you also have to watch out again for the fielders walking forward they creep in to your frame, the runner is favorite for that when your shooting the bowler. You will often see half the runner in the opposite end batter shots. Pain in the arse.

Getting the keeper in is to show a little more in the shot, I am probably shooting for a publication on those with the hope of getting bails in the air as 200mm in portrait just gets the batter at this venue and if he swings for the ball the bat gets chopped off so I zoom out a little and end up with more in. when shooting end on outdoors its a lot easier to get a position.

The stuff at the Reebok snaps with Lofty I was just standing near the entrance while people came in they saw the camera and posed, I tried to get lofty to stand in space so when he turned to me there was nothing in the background but he always moved forwards again so I need to be more forcefull. On the 2nd night 14th I had the 8x7 highlite set up in the corner and a mate shooting on that, we had lofty for about 10 minutes due to everything else going on. Maybe we should have had the highlight set up near the entrance but Lofty was there to great the guests not work for me. Looking through them again yeah I need to crop tighter. I always thought I got too close but looking again I am not close enough. The prom background was an emergency dad phoned can you do this for us so pair of flash guns, brollies and stands with the colapsable in the boot of the car, its a horible background but it was better than a wall so did the job.

Head and shoulders shots OK I think the 2x will be coming out more. I have concentrated a lot on Horwich I think I will spread out and shoot the other teams and make albums up of the teams rather than match by match to build up photos of teams where yes get the close frame and the full length frame. The guy who is diving in the index image for Heaton V Horwich is so desperate for me to catch him doing that but catching the ball I have come close on 2 other occasions but they were out of focus so hopfully the 1D will help me grab that shot.

Lots of stuff to look at and change for me so thanks I am still open for more comments.

[muttleymacclad]

Another thought on the cricket, can you not get some shots of them practicing / warming up? It may be cheating a bit but you may not get as much background 'interference' yet still get action shots. Certainly the bowlers will be 'gettable' practicing in the nets.

mml

[Little John]

I tried that on saturday as I wanted a team photo so I was down in the hall for warm up 4 cricket balls flying about with enthusiastic bowling and batting an enclosed hall is not a good place to be especially as hitting the photographer can be classed as a fun game by some.

[Little John]

Ok I have uploaded last Sundays shots, far more selective on the ones uploaded and cropped closer, I still can't bring myself to lighten the faces if wearing a hat but I will see what the bloke thinks tomorrow. and again what do you think?

I think if I crop so tight I am going to need to limit the print sizes to which ever ratio I crop, which would you go for 9x6 or 8x6?

[BertRoot]

8x6 is a more common frame size.

[crashtestmac]

I always try and stick to the outbound the camera ratio....
6x4
9x6
12x8
Etc.
The frames cam be tricky to get but I always offer them framed as well sobthey can buy the frame from me if they cannot find one....

Most place have started doing a 9x6 option even and and sainsburys sell them now... I got a LOAD before Christmas from Photomart for about 80p each.

I am on my phone at the moment so will check your website later.

The main thing with sports like cricket is that the lighting does not change much. You can take a reading then switch to manual rather than aperture or shutter priority. This will allow you to get the exposure correct for the faces in the shadows.

The problem starts with clouds but you can just compensate for them as it happens with exposure compensation or a tweek of appeared or shutter...

Sent from my HTC Sensation XE with Beats Audio using Tapatalk

[Little John]

8x6 is a more common frame size.

yep thats my thinking about it also

I always try and stick to the outbound the camera ratio....
6x4
9x6
12x8
Etc.
The frames cam be tricky to get

and that is what I prefer easier to frame the shot when in close no messing with cropping what I see is what I get.