More tube strikes!

[H4ss4n]

Tube Workers To Strike For Five Days

Londoners are set to endure major disruption for the second time this year as tube workers announce walkouts in April and May.

3:42pm UK, Thursday 17 April 2014
A tube strike in February closed stations across London

• A crowded platform at Clapham Junction train station as tube strikes continue to cause havoc for commuters.
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• London Mayor Boris Johnson takes the tube on the District Line to Southfields.
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• The 48-hour shut down of some of the Underground network in London was due to industrial action over the planned closure of ticket offices.
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• Crowds disembarking from the London Overground at Clapham Junction Station.
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• A stairwell guarded at Clapham Junction station, where a one-way system in place.
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• Crowds at Clapham Junction as commuters rush to take overground trains.
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• Long queues have built up at bus stops and railway stations after the first of two 48-hour stoppages by London Underground staff got under way.
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• Queues at Waterloo station.
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• One disgruntled passenger told Sky News he faced a walk of more than an hour to work on Wednesday as a result of the industrial action. Picture courtesy of twitter use @tomkingham
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• One commuter Paul Hutchinson wrote ‘Thought I could get the district line from tower hill. I was sadly mistaken...’
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• Picture courtesy of Twitter user @tomkingham
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• Picture courtesy of Twitter user @tomkingham
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• Commuters queue for buses outside London Victoria Station.
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• London's Westminster Underground Station.
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• A service information board states "No Piccadilly Line" tube trains during strikes at Green Park underground station.
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• A lone taxi stops to collect passengers from a busier than normal taxi rank at Victoria Station.
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• Commuters queue for buses at London's Waterloo station.
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• An official picket line at London Bridge Underground Station.
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• Commuters at London Bridge Underground Station.
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• The Mayor of London Boris Johnson meets commuters and staff at London Bridge Underground Station.
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• Passengers wait on the eastbound platform of the District Line at Victoria Station.
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• Commuters walk and cycle across London's Waterloo Bridge
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Gallery: February 6 Tube Strike
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Tube workers in London are to take five days of strike action in the coming weeks over ticket office closures.
Members of the RMT union will walk out from 9pm on Monday April 28 for two days and again from 9pm on Monday May 5 for three days.
The first two days of action will take place before a May Day event in London in memory of former RMT leader Bob Crow, and politician and campaigner Tony Benn, who died within days of each other last month.
RMT acting general secretary Mick Cash said assurances given when the union suspended a planned strike earlier this month had been "ripped up and thrown back in our faces".
Mr Cash blamed Tube management for "cynically wrecking" long-running talks aimed at settling a dispute over the closure of ticket offices and subsequent job losses.
The scene at Clapham Junction during February strikes He said: "Staff are furious that while senior management pay and staffing levels are being allowed to roar ahead the jobs and pay of the core, station-based staff, who are the interface with the travelling public are being torn to ribbons.
"The assurances that were given at the time RMT suspended the original action for a proper evaluation of the cuts plans have been ripped up and thrown back in our faces.
"As a result, RMT has no option but to put on further strike action in the expectation that the management will now halt these dangerous cuts plans and engage in meaningful and serious talks on the future of a tube network running at full tilt, with further demands in the pipeline, which needs more staff and not less to operate safely."
London Underground responded to the announcement by reiterating there will be no compulsory redundancies as a result of any ticket office closures.
They say the RMT has failed to put forward "any credible alternative".
London Underground has urged the RMT to continue with talks "Over the past eight weeks, we have met with our trade union colleagues on over 40 occasions, listening to their concerns and making significant changes as a result," said chief operating officer Phil Hufton.
"I've committed to looking at ways to ensure that no one will lose pay and no supervisor will have to apply for their own job.
"There will be no compulsory redundancies and all requests for voluntary redundancy will be honoured.
"However, the RMT leadership has rejected these changes and has not put forward any credible alternative proposals.
"Next week, we will sit down again with the Aslef, TSSA and Unite unions for further discussions on our plans and how we can meet the needs of our customers in 21st century London.
"I urge the RMT to join us, rather than threaten further unnecessary disruption to Londoners. All a strike will achieve is to lose those who take part pay for each day of action."
Workers from the TSSA rail union - including Transport for London managers and supervisors - have also voted to go on strike in a separate row over pay.
More follows...

http://news.sky.com/story/1244489/tu...-for-five-days

[Goldberg]

*Sigh*

To be honest they need to grow some fucking balls and do it properly then. Over the last 10 years I have never failed to get to work when a Strike takes place. They always ensure that you can mostly get to your destination, although you have to chop and change slightly more than usual and take alternatives (Bus, DLR, Overground) in places.

So if your going to strike, shut it all down or don't do it at all...

[Zippeyrude]

Change is inevitable and those overpaid tfl staff should move with it
These golden jobs must change
Being on the day that all tubes are driverless

[4me2]

Change is inevitable and those overpaid tfl staff should move with it
These golden jobs must change
Being on the day that all tubes are driverless

Disagree with everything you are saying.

Britain needs more strikes but the average Joe is too brainwashed by The Sun and Daily Mail so solidarity no longer belongs in UK's vocab.

The real Golden are those held by the self-serving pigs in Westminster.

[Zippeyrude]

i dont disagree at all regarding the westminster pigs. same goes for the bankers and obscene rewards for grotesque failure. but i will not be led to believe that the tube jobs that are currently being undertaken are so demanding or skilled as to warrant the salaries that they command, nor do i believe that that demand exists for those jobs.

furthermore, when the parasites they held the country to ransom prior to the olympics and succeeded in obtaining a bonus for just doing their jobs they lost all respect from me...

[4me2]

i dont disagree at all regarding the westminster pigs. same goes for the bankers and obscene rewards for grotesque failure. but i will not be led to believe that the tube jobs that are currently being undertaken are so demanding or skilled as to warrant the salaries that they command, nor do i believe that that demand exists for those jobs.

furthermore, when the parasites they held the country to ransom prior to the olympics and succeeded in obtaining a bonus for just doing their jobs they lost all respect from me...

You really have bought into The Sun propaganda.

The only reason they don't want to pay them decent wages is because it harms the privatisation plans of the pigs. The same pigs who will profit from the privatisation so they through up a shit storm
of bullshit to turn the workers against each other.

[MsDG]

You really have bought into The Sun propaganda.

The only reason they don't want to pay them decent wages is because it harms the privatisation plans of the pigs. The same pigs who will profit from the privatisation so they through up a shit storm
of bullshit to turn the workers against each other.

There is nothing worse than those on here that think that people that have different opinions to them are somehow brainwashed by the media. You can use that argument for anyone (for instance) anyone could say that you have been brainwashed by the loony left!

Twice now Zippy has responded purely to topic of the thread. Twice now you have personally insulted him by insinuating that he is unable to reach his own logical conclusion without media influence... Somehow he does not seem to have the "super blinkers" that enables you to have the only correct decision impervious to outside influence.

The fact is you have no real way of knowing how zippy has come to his conclusions, and by just continually grabbing at that "media" angle out of the air only proves that your argument is based partly (if not wholly) on wild speculation.

I have to say it is my experience that it seems to be a generally re-occurring theme on DF that when ever someone supports strike action, part of their rebuttal (who ever it is) is to personally attack the person of differing opinion. It almost seems that a complete lack of valid argument in supporting a strike leaves you only with personal insult as your major defense!

So, here's an idea.... why not just stick to valid argument of the original topic and leave the personal shit alone?

[Zippeyrude]

I wonder how many people read the 'news'?

- We all probably have.

I wonder how many people have been union stewards and have seen the benefits of unions, but also how they can be overly militant, arrogant and protect those that are undeserving of protection (cases of theft, violence, etc)?

- I have.

I wonder how many people that have expressed opinions have actually received information relating to TfL remuneration and pay rewards after having made requests to TfL under the Freedom of Information Act?

- I have.

Suffice to say that there really are people out there that are able to draw conclusions from a variety of sources.

So, back to the original point... there are cases where the salaries have been overinflated. The monopolistic nature of the service gives it great power in leveraging its position, a few people strike and many suffer. Many hard working people.

The fact that one part of society (camerons banking buddies) have abused the system does not make a free for all the right thing to do.

Ironically that is greed, a capitalist trait. The ones that suffer are those that really are lowly paid by comparison and that imo should receive more - nursing and teaching.

[Geko]

I hate these threads....! We cover the same ground and people never soften in their opinions.

So, back to the original point... there are cases where the salaries have been overinflated. The monopolistic nature of the service gives it great power in leveraging its position, a few people strike and many suffer. Many hard working people.

The fact that one part of society (camerons banking buddies) have abused the system does not make a free for all the right thing to do.

Ironically that is greed, a capitalist trait. The ones that suffer are those that really are lowly paid by comparison and that imo should receive more - nursing and teaching.

Saying that. I had to address the above point. Those who work on the tube aren't striking through greed. 50k a year, is not greed. Yes they are overpaid, if we use industry benchmarks. But in reality, everyone else is underpaid. They are trying to find a living wage. Most manual work won't afford you a living wage.

Also... Comparing bankers who gamble with other people's money with zero compassion and who take home 7 figure bonuses, to people striking for the reason of reversing planned job cuts, is not a fair comparison.

And lastly... I agree. Nurses and teachers deserve more. But... there are well paid people in the NHS and schooling. They just don't happen to be on the front line (another injustice...!). Maybe if they followed the RMTs example, they may also do a bit better. But.... Then we'd all complain about how they are holding the country to ransom and putting people's lives at risk. People don't get paid more because it's the right thing to do, unfortunately. You have to take it forcefully, by uniting...!

[4me2]

There is nothing worse than those on here that think that people that have different opinions to them are somehow brainwashed by the media. You can use that argument for anyone (for instance) anyone could say that you have been brainwashed by the loony left!

Twice now Zippy has responded purely to topic of the thread. Twice now you have personally insulted him by insinuating that he is unable to reach his own logical conclusion without media influence... Somehow he does not seem to have the "super blinkers" that enables you to have the only correct decision impervious to outside influence.

The fact is you have no real way of knowing how zippy has come to his conclusions, and by just continually grabbing at that "media" angle out of the air only proves that your argument is based partly (if not wholly) on wild speculation.

I have to say it is my experience that it seems to be a generally re-occurring theme on DF that when ever someone supports strike action, part of their rebuttal (who ever it is) is to personally attack the person of differing opinion. It almost seems that a complete lack of valid argument in supporting a strike leaves you only with personal insult as your major defense!

So, here's an idea.... why not just stick to valid argument of the original topic and leave the personal shit alone?

If anyone else but you had posted this then I may have taken more than 30 seconds to have read it and pondered over it.

But being as it was you I'll redirect it to the give a fuck department.

[Zippeyrude]

Fair and reasonable points geko.

But if by industry benchmarks tube workers are overpaid, by wanting more they are expecting a disproportionate reward for the job they do.

I agree that a living wage is difficult to find, but i cannot believe that, say 40 or 50k, doesnt allow that.

Many people expect luxuries to be comodities. Since when was junk food, satellite tv or drinking and smoking a human right? Ok a vast generalisation but many could afford to live very comfortably on £40k a year.

And yes, i intended the front line NHS staff that were grossly underpaid.

The RMTs example would only be fair if the matters that they were striking over was as a result of them being worse off, or prejudiced in a material way - other than trying to keep hold of jobs that are not required any more. And I dont hear any of them suggesting that their ill deserved olympic bonuses should be given back. That is greed, simples.

Times move on. Change has to happen. If it didnt we would all still have typing pools at work.

[Zippeyrude]

If anyone else but you had posted this then I may have taken more than 30 seconds to have read it and pondered over it.

But being as it was you I'll redirect it to the give a fuck department.

Irony springs to mind...

Not considering various sides to a debate.... if we all acted like that, we could be accused of being brainwashed

[Over Carl]

I agree that part of the reason the country is being allowed to go down the pan is that people aren't ready to strike to defend themselves.

However £50k for driving a train is obscene. If we consider the train driver only has to think about forward/stop, doors open/close, how much does a coach driver deserve then considering he has to steer the thing, refuel it, etc?


Also modernisation is inevitable in many sectors. Rather then strike to keep a job that serves no purpose, I'm guessing a wise person in that situation would accept the situation and move on asap and start working on your new career today rather than try to delay it for weeks or months naively thinking by striking they may retain these positions until you are ready to retire.

I'm all for people sticking up to defend themselves, but this is simply a pure piss take that will affect loads of innocent people who haven't got the luxury of being paid twice the market rate for work that doesn't even need to be done.

[macmilm]

If anyone else but you had posted this then I may have taken more than 30 seconds to have read it and pondered over it.

But being as it was you I'll redirect it to the give a fuck department.

What? Even Goldberg?

[Goldberg]

What I sometimes do not understand is why it becomes news and an issue for the whole of the country? Why should people who have no access to the tubes and never will be subject to the drama every time?
As I mentioned, being a commuter during the strikes I can still get to where I need to be. It's never that much of a big deal, inconvenient yes, but the drama they make of it nationwide and probably worldwide is overhyped.

All the strikes do is identify the lazy folk who use it as an excuse not to goto work. People with kids I understand but some folk just need any excuse.

Most south London folk use the overground which is not affected by the strikes.

[blacksheep]

So lets say we up everyone's wages 30%. What happens to the price of shopping in a supermarket, the price of getting your car fixed, the price of goods we export? They all go up - nobody is better off, we export less and the country as a whole is worse off.

[4me2]

So lets say we up everyone's wages 30%. What happens to the price of shopping in a supermarket, the price of getting your car fixed, the price of goods we export? They all go up - nobody is better off, we export less and the country as a whole is worse off.

Very onesided.

People also have more spending power which inturn creates new jobs and keeps people in jobs.
that's why in places like Germany when you lose your job you get paid 2/3 of your last wages for upto 12 months.
You don't lose your house or car and still buy things and inject money into the economy.

Pay people £70 a week make them bankrupt and brand them as lazy, drive them to mental illness which all take money out of the economy.
British society is fucking shit for average honest working person.

[BigBird]

I agree with modernisation to cut costs when it comes to industries where the UK have to compete with other countries such as in the steel industry for example.

As for a service industry like the tube I believe that jobs for people is more important, but wages should reflect the job they do and should compare with similar jobs in the same part of the country. (">

[blacksheep]

Very onesided.

People also have more spending power which inturn creates new jobs and keeps people in jobs.
that's why in places like Germany when you lose your job you get paid 2/3 of your last wages for upto 12 months.
You don't lose your house or car and still buy things and inject money into the economy.

Pay people £70 a week make them bankrupt and brand them as lazy, drive them to mental illness which all take money out of the economy.
British society is fucking shit for average honest working person.

nope they have no more spending power as all most goods that you purchase (including houses) will go up 30% due to labour costs and the fact that everyone knows everyone has more money.

I don't see how ruining our very small exports y jacking up prices is going to create or maintain jobs.

Do you know the price of say a vvs1 f coloured emerald cut diamanond is worth? You're talking multiple thousands - know what it's worth if debeers opened up their vaults and released everything, a fraction of the cost (£100's) - if they know people can and will pay then that's what they charge you.

[Goldberg]

So, this morning....

Set off an hour earlier (6:30am) and got a Bus from the borders of Essex to Stratford.
Jumped on an overground train from Stratford to London, swapped onto a tube and reached my destination half hour earlier than I normally would.

Two things that annoyed me other than the fact I had to do this in order to get to work:

1. Some silly bint arguing with the Bus Driver about how she was not paying. She was not paying because the Tubes were striking. It was about 5 minutes later that people started shouting "Love, your issue is with the London Underground and not the Buses. All you are doing is delaying our journey"
She then told us we were all weak and touched her Oyster onto the reader. Yes, we are weak because she gave up. However it was funny in the end as she had no credit and had to leave the bus anyway!

2. When I got to work, I found out that the Central Line which I would normally use was running. The stations opened at 7:00am

So, yet again it has failed to have a huge impact on me. An extra 30 mins travelling time which could have been avoided if I knew that the stations would open at 7:00am
There will however be the folk who cry 'Tube Strike' and do not even attempt to get into work.