Six-point penalty for using mobile at the wheel

[DJ OD]

Not saying it doesn't happen.

I just question the amount of cases like that. And also that penalising afterwards does no good to change driver attitudes or their driving standards any more than it does bring people back from the dead.

If said driver hadn't have killed anyone, but still got stopped. He will still be the same now. texting and driving etc. Just with 6 points on his license.

Having points on your license from such a thing wont help. And 6 over 3 is pointless.


DJ OD

[Mr.James]

everyone seems to think they are an above average driver.............

Above average? I'd say I was prob in the top 1% judging by the amount of morons I see on the road on a daily basis. I can't drive for more than 5 mins without seeing someone driving poorly.


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[4me2]

Just for info people, tiggerbiker is a fully qualified Driving and motorcycle instructor and has been for many years.

He talks from from first hand experience.

[tiggerbiker]

ahhh, i see your point DJ

if the threat of 3 points, fines & insurance implications hasnt stopped them, 6 points wont do anything either.

i will admit that most of the people on speed awareness courses (SAC) are seasoned drivers that were trained many years ago to always be in top gear ASAP - with modern motors that results in going slightly faster than planned.
all the reckless speed freaks are normally going much faster than the SAC cut off point and get points/banned etc - those that are accidentally above the limit due to old school training are given the opportunity to retrain without blemishing their licenses

[BigBird]

Off topic I know but..
Something I have believed firmly for a very long time is an upper age limit.. e.g. Once you hit 55 you must re-take some form of test every 2 or 3 years....

55 is not old these days. I will be 55 in just over a years time. I am more intelligent and my mind is still sharper than 100% of people I know that are younger than me. Add to this the years of experience I have behind the wheel and the lack of young persons reckless 'cant see the danger' attitude. I also have perfect eyesight, but know of some people in their twenties who drive without their glasses because they want to look cool.

Do you actually know any 55 year old that is a bad driver because of their age?. I don't. I know 55 year old bad drivers, but they have been bad at it since they first started driving over 35 years ago. (">

[flumperino]

I've had a licence for 6 years, have probably driven for a total of 50 hours during that time, with none of those hours being in the last 2 years.

I do find it quite scary that I am allowed to jump in a car tomorrow and start driving, I can barely remember which pedal is which

[tiggerbiker]

55 is not old these days. I will be 55 in just over a years time. I am more intelligent and my mind is still sharper than 100% of people I know that are younger than me. Add to this the years of experience I have behind the wheel and the lack of young persons reckless 'cant see the danger' attitude. I also have perfect eyesight, but know of some people in their twenties who drive without their glasses because they want to look cool.

Do you actually know any 55 year old that is a bad driver because of their age?. I don't. I know 55 year old bad drivers, but they have been bad at it since they first started driving over 35 years ago. (">

i dont think bad driving is age related - more ATTITUDE related.

as 4me2 said, i am an experienced instructor with over 15 years of teaching on the roads, i did track day teaching before that and have been a (fairly unsuccessful) club racer before that - all this has taught me that i have a lot more to learn about driving/riding
i dont mean this directed at anyone who has posted in this thread but in my experience, the worst drivers are the ones that think/say they are better than the rest - its best to be humble behind the wheel/handlebars, accept you are never to old to learn & accept you are not perfect - but it doesnt stop you trying to be perfect

[macmilm]

55 is not old these days. I will be 55 in just over a years time. I am more intelligent and my mind is still sharper than 100% of people I know that are younger than me. Add to this the years of experience I have behind the wheel and the lack of young persons reckless 'cant see the danger' attitude. I also have perfect eyesight, but know of some people in their twenties who drive without their glasses because they want to look cool.

Do you actually know any 55 year old that is a bad driver because of their age?. I don't. I know 55 year old bad drivers, but they have been bad at it since they first started driving over 35 years ago. (">

55 was a hasty example but your prolly right.... so is 65 more acceptable you old bastard ??? ;-)

[macmilm]

i dont think bad driving is age related - more ATTITUDE related.

I dont think it is just age related but I have seen many an example where it was deffo down to age.. yes 55 was a poor example but you get what I mean

[tiggerbiker]

I dont think it is just age related but I have seen many an example where it was deffo down to age.. yes 55 was a poor example but you get what I mean

yes, i do get your point
unfortunately a lot of medical problems have to be reported to the DVLA by the driver - if the driver knows that the DVLA will revoke a license due to them reporting a health issue, the driver wont do it or they just dont think its anyones buisness or its as bad as the doctor/ opthamologist says it is - basically has the attitude of' i know better than you - so there'
i believe there should be a random reassessment of all drivers of any age and compulsory reassessment of all drivers yearly that are of pension age. i also think they should do the same for prospective car drivers that prospective bike riders have to do - limited power to weight ratios depending on age, off road vehicle handling tests before the main road test & make pass plus compulsory for all classes so everyone gets motorway lessons

[Lighty]

I once had to do an advanced driving course when i was in the army before I went back to ireland, its not something that youd do over here or on civvy street, but if you want extremely fast j turns in tight spaces and want your brake lights rigged so they dont light up when you brake, weapon concealment in a rover coupe or a Vaxhaul calibra, best place to ram someone to disable them or best place to get hit if you have to take a hit, or how to use a vehicle as a weapoon then im definitely your man All jokes aside, everyone thinks their better than the next bloke, mostly they are talking bollocks. Personally I use my car to get from A to B and nothing more, I do have a hands free kit in my Range Rover but I dont use it, if my phone rings I either pull over if its very important (Very Rare) or I just ring them back as im gettin out of the car, its simple and I get lots of inclusive minutes its not like its going to cost me anything or anyone else their life. As for drink drivers I despise them all and dont understand it at all, you rarely ever more than a tenner in a taxi away from home, if you are then its normally a planned event and travel will be pre arranged i.e. a lift of mum/dad or a stay over in a hotel or something.

[burner1]

If I recall correctly as a very young lad living in Germany (Dad was in the Army), we had this painted out 'road system' on the tarmac at my school along with pedestrian crossings and traffic lights etc. We used to drive go karts about these roads. All good fun at the time, but we learnt a lot from it.

Maybe it would be a better idea to teach road sense to kids at a younger age rather than banning them from the roads until they are older than they are now.

[rebrabuk]

I am going to get flamed to fuck for this but anyway,

Driving standards on the whole are the problem. Not using a phone at the same time. I often see people using phones while driving, while commuting to work. I also do not see them ploughing down a street full of people.

Road deaths in the UK may be on the increase, but people need to look deeper as to why that is.

Too many cars, too many foreign drivers (not racist there, just a fact; some countries have different standards of driving), too many kids now think its a neccesity to drive as soon as they can. Kids in all honesty are the ones killing people when driving either drunk or on a mobile phone. A lack of experience or confidence. Mistakes from bad judgement. etc etc

I am a very good driver, very experienced. If I was in a situation where I needed to call someone when driving I could do and I would not crash. If I had 2 beers in the pub and had to use my car in an emergency I would not crash my car. I don't do these things on a regular basis but no one would die if I did.

Now if you have a young, nervous, girly driver... who has a cold, and gets a facebook status update while putting her lippy on in the mirror, then unfortunately you will likely see an accident.

Any changes to driving law, or penalties annoy me. Because no one really thinks beyond the headline grabbing incidents, scaremongering and paranoia that you hear.

Make driving tests harder, more expensive. Stop foreigners from driving here for more than 4 weeks without passing a proper test. A test that takes a few days not hours.

Like Finland.

Or some shit.


DJ OD

I'm quoting this because it needs to be repeated.

Amen.

[BigBird]

55 was a hasty example but your prolly right.... so is 65 more acceptable you old bastard ??? ;-)

Not really acceptable but at least it gives me another eleven years before you prematurely retire me from the roads and onto a mobility scooter. (">

[pratman]

fuck this shit, i cant believe people are claiming they can comfortably claim they can drive and use their phone, i dont think anyone is claiming that every time you use your phone you will kill someone but the fact you are using your phone while driving and you knowingly answer that makes it premeditated and if you were to kill someone due to you doing that then i believe you should be up for murder because you are knowingly answering your phone with the knowledge that you could kill someone by answering it, effectively making it a murder weapon. you have no excuse for that.

[macmilm]

Not really acceptable but at least it gives me another eleven years before you prematurely retire me from the roads and onto a mobility scooter. (">

Ok, Ok can we compromise on 70 ???? To be fair tho there are some pretty nippy mobility scooters these days... would love one myself personally. You are even allowed to drive them right upto the bar in the pub and then onto your table..
Most even have a little basket that can easily fit a a good few pints (if its your round) and a few packets of nuts. no messing
Can't wait ;-)

[blaggard]

As an ex Driving Instructor I'm absolutely sure most of the people thinking they are the shits would find out otherwise if they submitted themselves to training. I used to teach advanced as well as skid control (not just beginners) and will refuse friends and family asking me to assess their driving, not worth it! The fact is the National pass rate has hovered around 50% since inception, the Driving Test is and has always been a joke, it's a little harder now than when I last worked (80s) but not much, all you would be Schumachers are likely dangerous without even being aware, the worst kind!
When I started boys/men on an advanced course I would virtually have to make them cry before they would listen to me whereas girls/women often starting with a lower skill set would actually really want to learn and listen to what they were being told.
Women usually have a worse spatial sense than men (sorry girls this is a fact) but if interested in becoming better drivers are much more prepared to accept the training, men just see it as an attack on their manhood!
I was once teaching a female research Doctor (medical) she told me that females are much more likely to have problems distinguishing between left and right AND generally have little spatial awareness because of the way the two halves of their brains are connected, this also gives them more innate ability to multi-task. Suck it up boys, you are NOT all fantastic drivers and if you think you are fine while talking on the phone you are deluding yourselves, other distractions are also dangerous but telephone conversations are particularly so.

[MsDG]

You are just bitter and twisted because you got caught breaking the law and rightly punished, I didn't ignore anything I replied to the misguided, irrelevant and selfish remarks you made trying to get sympathy when you know the law, you are not the first one to be caught or punished in that way and I would have also presume you used it not only in standing traffic.

Plenty of laws I don't like or agree with but that does not mean they don't apply to me or I can whine like a 5 year old girl how others do it and don't get punished or how unfair it is. YOU KNOW THE LAW

Its quite an interesting topic with lots of of official research to bring into the debate that makes it far from a clear cut issue. However, please feel free not to contribute with some valid thoughts on the issues raise... just pick out one thing I said out of many... and just chip in with how wrong I am without really making any real counter argument. If you are not going to be bothered to add anything of value to the thread, why bother?

As for the law, virtually on a weekly basis on this forum some kind of breach of law is highlighted which is then discussed on the merits of its correctness. Now its very clear where you stand on the law in this issue and its also clear where I stand on the law. However, this does not make you right just because "its the law". However, nor does that make me right either. The difference is, I am not an arrogant and dismissive of other peoples points. I also seem capable of responding the various arguments raised without resorting to personal attack.

As for sympathy? WTF?. I honestly could not give a shit about my (long spent) phone conviction. Jesus, t was only 3 points... not 10 years inside. LOL, If there is one place on the planet that does NOT give sympathy it's DF.... why the fuck would I want sympathy of you lot? Even for your pool of insults, that was a bit empty barrel chuck!

Please feel free to continue ignoring all the various points in this whole thread, and just re-emphasise you very closed opinion... oh, and don't forget to have another pop at me... or better still just remind us again how you are far to busy to enter into any constructive debate because any view point that differs from yours is so wrong it is not worth talking about!

Actually no... probably far better just to say you couldn't be even arsed to read this post. I'm sure that will quickly show how very fly you are without having to resort to intelligent conversation!

[Bald Bouncer]

Its quite an interesting topic with lots of of official research to bring into the debate that makes it far from a clear cut issue. However, please feel free not to contribute with some valid thoughts on the issues raise... just pick out one thing I said out of many... and just chip in with how wrong I am without really making any real counter argument. If you are not going to be bothered to add anything of value to the thread, why bother?

As for the law, virtually on a weekly basis on this forum some kind of breach of law is highlighted which is then discussed on the merits of its correctness. Now its very clear where you stand on the law in this issue and its also clear where I stand on the law. However, this does not make you right just because "its the law". However, nor does that make me right either. The difference is, I am not an arrogant and dismissive of other peoples points. I also seem capable of responding the various arguments raised without resorting to personal attack.

As for sympathy? WTF?. I honestly could not give a shit about my (long spent) phone conviction. Jesus, t was only 3 points... not 10 years inside. LOL, If there is one place on the planet that does NOT give sympathy it's DF.... why the fuck would I want sympathy of you lot? Even for your pool of insults, that was a bit empty barrel chuck!

Please feel free to continue ignoring all the various points in this whole thread, and just re-emphasise you very closed opinion... oh, and don't forget to have another pop at me... or better still just remind us again how you are far to busy to enter into any constructive debate because any view point that differs from yours is so wrong it is not worth talking about!

Actually no... probably far better just to say you couldn't be even arsed to read this post. I'm sure that will quickly show how very fly you are without having to resort to intelligent conversation!

Wow I hit a raw nerve there, you really are still very bitter about the fine and points, I made my views on it very clear in the previous post I will post it again as YOU are the one who obviously didn't read it. Sorry I appear to of missed the the 'lots of of official research' you brought to the debate please enlighten me with the links I have missed you posted or actually post some then it can be debated and saying 'They do it or they get away with it why can't I' (please insert 5 year old girls voice) isn't an argument on the validity of the law.

I am not an arrogant and dismissive of other peoples points.

No honestly did you really keep a straight face typing this? really? no really?

Is it an offense to use a phone while diving the answer is yes, the fact they choose not to prosecute people using hands free devices only means they have chosen not to test the law to this extent and they have the option to prosecute for careless driving etc should there be an accident and the person was using a hands free device at the time or for that matter chatting to a passenger or fiddling with the radio

The argument on emergency is a very blinkered one and it is also very rare for them to use a hand held device while driving, perhaps you should consider the seat belt law and would you also be moaning if it was for that rather than the phone and do people who don't wear then in slow moving or stationary traffic suddenly abide by the law when in fast moving traffic. You are fully aware of the law so should accept it, stop moaning and not do it again.

As for the 6 points thing I agree with what has been said about 3 points being enough.

[macmilm]

I appear to of missed the the 'lots of of official research' you bought to the debate

Fuk me I'm feeling brave !!

<Flame retardant pants>

Brought not bought ;-)

</Flame retardant pants>